Two convenient options: Pay annually and save - $39.50 per yea We have one year remaining on the lease of the house we are renting, and her portion of rent will be drawn from this account as well. Something like that might make a bank reluctant to accept the will without the backing of the court. Hi Lynne, my deceased father's will dated 2015 names my Mother as a sole beneficiary of his entire estate, however does not list every single account he had. There is nothing else to pay out now. She asked each bank was this a problem, each said it was not a problem. How can he sign papers, cheques if he is not physically able to do so? Do I have to go open an estate account for,this one cheque. Not the same thing. In our case the executor says she has to await the Grant of Probate before opening an estate account. I believe you are wrong about avoiding probate because of the joint account. My dad passed away and has no will, no assets, no liabilities, no bank account. I charge $400 for that.Lynne. I need to set up an estate account for him. Now the bank is on the hook for the full funds because they released the funds to the wrong person. He was a financial broker and received commissions from the insurance company, These commissions are to continue to me but the insurance co. can only make them payable to my husband's name>(because they are only payable to a broker). does this have to go through Probate? This does seem like a genuine mistake, but certainly a preventable one. That's interesting. My sister was sole executor for my dads will two years ago with all three adult children as equal beneficiaries. If not, you might try escalating your request up through the bank's channels until you find someone willing to actually make the simple change. . Hello Lynn,I'm setting up an estate account for my mother. Do I have any rights to see this paperwork? Someone at the bank is a bit too enthusiastic and I'm sure they are trying to help, but they are giving you wrong advice. Not at all a fan of RBC, in fact in the process of switching banks myself. (In case my brother contested the Will, I would still get the money). For example, some estate accounts are restricted in a way that allows deposits but no withdrawals can be made without a court order. Sat-Sun 8 a.m.-8 p.m. ); Your joint executors might have a strained or non-existent . Can I open an estate account and deposit his cheque into it. There are no inheritance or estate taxes in Canada. It's 2500.00. I now realize I should not have closed it as we have to do taxes next year. Hi Lynne, My brother is the executor of my mothers estate. While I find this admirable in spirit, I am concerned as an executor whether executors can in fact make gifts that are not specifically covered in the will, especially as there are other residual beneficiaries involved. You have not just a right to see the paperwork but it is your responsibility to straighten all of this out.Definitely use some of the money to pay bills. Note that the credit union confirmed probate isnt required as the total amount of the estate is around 10,000.Thank you. The new mortgage require the pre-auth form to be from an account with my name as the administrator to my sister's estate. Do you mind if I place your article on my blog and reference your site to it?Cheers,Larosabelle, Hi Larosabelle,Thanks! My mother-in-law passed away one month ago, she was in an assisted living apartment. All from my laptop. I have seen copies of the draft and the amount in the Estate account that was left in March, so I know this is the last big payment left. I don't need the money but want this to be resolved. Use any other estate funds you have been able to gather, such as the CPP death benefit or the sale of household contents. In her will, all three adult children are both equal executors and beneficiaries. Per the CRA website a T4RRSP/T4LIF/T4RRIF should be issued showing fair market value on date of deat, and interest earned from DOD until the end of the year. My experience has been that they do not allow online access in other banks either.Lynne. This is certainly not the law, but must be an internal policy of the bank. This was done after receiving the Probate Certificate which was scanned into the estate dept. If you haven't wound up the estate in a year and there is no good reason for it, you could end up in a dispute with the beneficiaries and possibly in court.Lynne. The information contained in this report references market data from MLS boards across Canada. Lynne. There is enough money in the account to pay the lump sum payments and still cover any surprises that may come up before final tax clearance is issued. You're right, that is the hold-up. Until then I have to ask for a balance and any bills I need to pay out of the account will have to be by bank draft. You have the right to deal with the account as well as the risk if you screw it up, so they aren't in a position to put up any resistance.Lynne. Hope this helps others who deal with RBC regarding non probated wills. I am the executor to my deceased elder sister's estate. The probate is their indemnity against the deceased's funds to the wrong person. My elderly (74) sister has made 2 partial distributions (3 siblings equal parts) and left enough for the CRA in the Estate account (says she has applied for a certificate). The estate accounts themselves are different from the original receipts, cheques, bank statements, etc. This is clearly a "screw you, this works for us" policy on behalf of the banks.Keeping detailed records makes sense. What kind of taxes will estate have to pay and can estate have an RRSP account?? If Empire Life insists on issuing a cheque to the estate, are they at all obliged to reimburse me for the probate fees I will have to pay on the money (300K) because they made a mistake in allowing the account to be set up that way? I tried depositing it in our joint account but they won't accept it. On July 21, I escalated my complaint to that bank's ombudsman. Does my daughter have to pay taxes on this as income for the year? Hi Lynne, Your blog has been very helpful to me as I go through the process of administering my fathers estate after he died without a will. Thanks! The debts of an estate are paid only to the extent that the estate (NOT the executor) has the funds to pay them.So, yes the executor does have access to estate funds right away, but no, a beneficiary does not. Thanks. We spoke with a tax specialist for the bank on the phone, and he said if the branch would update her accounts to show 'estate of' in the titles of the accounts he could reissue the slips to show the required information - however the branch is refusing stating probate requirement. I'm in Ontario, btw. Should I be raising cane at TD? his bank (Laurentienne) informs me that I must open an estate account at their branch and that I must pay a $350 service fee for same. Can Laurentienne refuse to transfer the funds from my decesased uncle's account to BMO? This might be repairing and restoring or it might not. Giving Power of Attorney Make sure the bank realizes that this is the only asset of the estate.Lynne. slips. Can the estate lend money to the executor who pays interest on it to the estate at the same rate the money is now receiving in a GIC? I was initially executor and stepped down due to personal reasons. A couple of months pass until her house was sold and the sale closed a week ago. Through the firm that handled my mothers taxes we have filed and received a refund for her 2017 taxes. We also offer guidance on tax strategies to maximize your family's wealth over time, managing assets, setting up trusts, and developing estate plans that cross jurisdictions. In reading their most recent annual report, the office of the ombudsman outlines the complaint process and time for resolution. is there any legislation preventing them from doing so? My question is when can I close the estate accounts? I am in a similar situation with no will for my deceased father. Whether or not he exceeded his authority is a matter for a judge in a civil court to decide so it muddies the water. I would suggest opening an estate account. If you are not applying for probate for any other reason, I don't see why you would apply for it because of a small cheque. Start Schedule A by plugging in the grand total from the final Inventory of Assets into Schedule A. If that gets around, that bank is going to see every cent owned by a deceased person put into estate accounts in other banks that are more reasonable.Lynne. The Momentum PLUS Savings Account is Scotiabank's high-interest savings account and offers a base rate of 1.60%. My mom passed in June, after living in long term care for just over a year. Have you taken the estate paperwork to the bank with the cheque? I received a cheque made payable to the Estate of my son with my name as well. Mum's UK state pension was overpaid by 1 week, having finally received notice of the amount, I now have to reimburse that myself because RBC refuses. One other question, the estate's co-executor would like to make a cash payment to a former care worker as recognition for her dedication. I would like to reference your site to them. And has instructed the last lawyer to not do anything even though he's the one who sent it without tracking by regular mail. She does not want me to see or access any of our moms personal documentation, banking information or personal paperwork she has in her possession. When my husband left , he said they did not care, they were not there to help, they would not listen and talked over him.Needless to say, no estate account was opened. I guess my question is do they have the right to not release the money once probate has been granted? CIBC had no problem setting up an estate account on provision of the will; RBC would not do that without probate. It'll happen. By the way, I checked out your site and it's really unique and interesting.Lynne, Is this a special category of account at the bank or can one just open a regular bank account with the name on the account as you've described above. How can I get them to allow me to do this. This sounds like an error to me, so you might consider contacting the manager of customer service at the bank and showing him/her a copy of the will, and asking that the account be properly set up.Lynne. It may seem inconvenient but there reasons for it, not the least of which is who is earning any interest on the account.Keep in mind that in law, that joint bank account belongs to your father, not to you, but that's a story for another post.Since I know nothing at all about your father, his marital situation, his assets, his debts, or anything else, I really couldn't say what you need to do. Lynne. Any recourse with these morons? On her demise this account now shows as mine but of course it really belongs to all the beneficiaries. The house had a secured LOC on it and we handed over the keys after telling bank no more payments would be made on LOC. RBC has made a royal mess for me to contend with. This meant the assets did not go through the Will, nor to my brother, yet all three banks released, the funds to my brother (2 banks, within hours of the day he and his daughter changed the POA to remove me, and just make it the two of them) it was almost a year, before my mother found out the POA had been changed, as she never asked for it to be changed. After it is all said and done the money will be divided between all 5 of us. Which we can't do until we pay estate tax. 8. I (probate granted estate trustee with a Will, and I am also the residuary beneficiary) opened 2 estate accounts for my mother's estate last year. I am a retired Branch Manager from another financial institution, so her attitude did not sit well with me and basically this manger argued with me on the phone. When they are one and the same person, the executor must only use the estate funds to pay estate costs and debts. The RSP is not in the estate if it names beneficiaries. The lawyer suggested it might be more efficient to use the law firm's trust accounts. If a CRA refund is the only asset in the estate, talk to the bank and ask if probate is really necessary under the circumstances. Had she appointed someone honest, this wouldn't have happened, but I'm sure she had no reason not to trust him. Your bank manager will be familiar with the process.If you do that, you can take control of the account, so you will be able to pay the taxes from it. I received a letter to say that Mom didn't qualify for the Canada Pension Death Benefit as she didn't pay in for enough years. One is to pay for the funeral up front and reimburse yourselves after the house sells. In my experience, none of the banks are very good at handling estates. Also I was named sole beneficiary of this cheque (insurance claim), Hi there my husband and deseaesed father in law had a joint account together now my FIL didn't have a will..can he still deposited life insurance cheques into the personal account (only child) or will he still have yo open up a estate account ?will our lawyer still have yo go to court to make him executar of estate? In law, you have no right to do so because you've been given the cheque as executor, which means it's in trust for the beneficiaries of the estate. I needed 2 estate accounts, one in C$ and one in US$. Once the funeral arrangements have been made and all interested parties informed of the death, one of the first things the executor must do is deal with the bank accounts of the deceased: Finding out what banks, credit card companies, and other financial institutions the deceased dealt with, notifying them that you are the executor, and determining the details of assets in all accounts. It's not because it's an investment account, but because of the value.Lynne. It is not unusual at all for a bank to insist on having a grant of probate before releasing funds. Do I need to set up a trust account to deposit this for her? In order for that to happen, there has to be a will that appoints you. The will states she was leaving everything (her house, bank accounts and investments ) to my mom and appointing me as executor. Excellent blog and thank you for writing the Self-Counsel press document "How Executors Avoid Personal Liability" in BC, published in 2014. CIBC requested personal ID documentation for each and every beneficiary on the account which I supplied although I was hesitant to believe the Money Laundering Act actually requires it. Given that the amount of funds in question is substantial, I wouldn't be surprised if they tell you they want probate.The bank might give your mother a break on this requirement, especially if she continues to keep all of her investments and accounts with them.Lynne. We went to a lawyer to arrange probate for my Aunt's Estate, and were planning to go to a bank to set up an estate bank account. Hello Lynne,My mother passed away in February and I am a co-executor along with my brother. The sole real asses, a condo, sold in December of 2018. Sometimes the bank will know about these, but sometimes you have to review old statements to figure it out. If that doesn't work, it would be way cheaper to courier the cheques to you to sign and send back, rather than fly there.Lynne. If you have provided a notarial copy of the will and a notarial copy of the death certificate, that should be enough for the bank to establish that you are the executor. Again, absolutely unacceptable.The situation needs to be cleaned up, and the quicker the better. I'm also more then willing to walk away from the account if I can't close it. I did not get a call back. My mom's estate is about $325,000 cash, which is being managed by Wood Gundy. Other terms for estate representative include estate trustee, executor, liquidator and administrator. Or do you actually mean mirror wills? Please let me know. You can expect to lose about 30 - 40% of it in taxes.Shouldn't you have figured all of this out BEFORE you complained for months?Lynne. This risk is eliminated (for the bank) by the probate process. That's very heavy-handed of them! Do we really have to go through probate? I'd suggest sitting in with your banking officer and having a chat. This is an on-going business with on-going income and bills that need to be paid. I have challenged them on this, and they keep telling me there is no estate department (I know this aint true, I have spoken with the estate department). If all of that is paid up, the funds go to his beneficiaries. During the estate planning process, the idea of adding a beneficiary, usually an adult child, to an existing bank account as a joint account holder can seem like an attractive, more efficient option than creating a will and then having your executor set up an estate account after you pass. I was under the impression from my mother's lawyer who handed me notarial copies of her will that that document gave me the legal right to proceed and get any bank accounts changed from her name individually to "The Estate of.." There is real estate and rental properties involved, with rent payments coming in and on-going expenses to be paid on a monthly basis. I want to ask my question to the bank but can I get your consent first? My father's house needs to be sold, we have to keep hydro on. I went into the bank to open an estate account so we can deposit money into that account and pay out accordingly but the bank (CIBC) will not let me open the account until probate is done. Is it necessary to wait for probate to be completed? I know this because I spent 7 years at Scotiabank doing whatever I could to help out the front line staff dealing with estates. My mother's partner has 3 sisters and a brother whom her partner didn't get along with and didn't have much to do with them. The banks have always agreed to this (with only one exception) because the funds aren't going to the executor or anyone else besides the court. Just be sure to keep detailed records of what came in and how you used the funds so that you can explain it all later.Lynne, My mother was killed suddenly and although she requested I be her executor she neglected to sign her will properly. I was hoping to close it out so there will be final closure to his estate ( there is not much to it ). Thank-you Alyssa. We have heard from others that other banks did not pull this. They seem to think that at the point where Registered accounts are cashed out to the estate is when taxes will be owed. Should we be concerned? All Canadian banks apparently have their own rules regarding estate accounts and probate. I also used the C$ account to pay out the interim inheritances last year. the cheque was made payable to the estate. I dont mean to me but to the beneficiaries of the monetary gifts. FIL was not natt8ed, Julie, what does "FIL was not natt8ed" mean?Lynne. Yes, all executors' names must be on it. So i'm very confused. Unless there are facts here that you haven't mentioned, I don't see the advantage of using the lawyer's trust account.Lynne. Will taxes apply to your estate in Canada? Is there a specific issue or problem or situation in your case that would be best served by having the lawyer control the funds? I am the executor of my mom's estate. So what I'm saying is that they have no reason to try to supervise what you're doing once you have provided the proof that you're the executor. My question is, do I need to apply for a probate grant before I go to a financial institution to open an estate account? You are the executor and you need to get control of this situation. Is there anyway around this? Your mother's money wasn't safe because your brother is a crook. I have paid some substantial expenses out of my own pocket and now require pay back fairly quickly as my own bills are due. I will ask the bank. The two of us are the only beneficiaries. All of our accounts are joint as are any debts ie mortgage and car. I just found out that the bank where the estate accounts exist is increasing fees for idle/dormant accounts (which these are, essentially) and I'd like to avoid being nickel and dimed for service fees. The things people will do to their own parents is absolutely appalling. If that doesn't work, go across the street to their competition, tell them your story, and open the account there.Lynne. Does the executor have the right to take the funds to any bank? The bank said if I get a letter from the lawyer saying that the application is in the process that I can open an estate account but will only be able to deposit, no withdrawals. Do I have to apply to Alberta Surrogate Court to have the will proven as valid before applying for probate? That institution is causing me a lot of distress by not allowing me to deposit items or pay small liabilities on her account. (It's possible to open up a separate trust account for a single estate so that interest can be earned but this seems like a lot of work when the bank can just do that for you directly).Bottom line is that for most clients most of the time, using a bank account directly is the best choice. If so, it will pose quite a hardship on her as a student. Yep. The client is now deceased and her power of attorney signed the cheque although I do not believe it was a joint account as only the deceased name is on the cheque. I am her executor and sole beneficiary. No, I don't think you can deposit it to your personal account or cash it. Your husband's estate is separate from him. Went in to my local branch to start distributing funds to the beneficiaries when to my utter shock was informed the Probate papers had been rejected by the Estate Dept's legal wing due to the inability to read to signatures on the will, thus not allowing me to touch any of the funds. Hello Lynne.I am the executor of my fathers estate. Is there a time limit on how long an estate account can stay open? Is there a dollar limit for banks? Will i need a letter of administration to open an estate account or will my bank let me sign a letter of indemnity? TD does not and all transactions must be processed in person. It makes sense from their perspective to make sure they have the right executor. What is your question? You can open an estate bank account after initiating probate and petitioning the court for formal recognition as executor or administrator. Still to this day I have not heard anything. One bank in which the deceased has an account and who also know my mom from frequently coming to the bank as she was not an online banker are paying the bills as the moment for the house. I somehow doubt this, but if yes, what additional documentation would be required?2.What are the ramifications of moving money from her account as it is today to myself for repayment? The alberta bank is insisting on probate. Any credit card debt or personal loan debt will be paid from the deceased's bank accounts before the account administrator takes control of any assets. I have set up an estate account.The probate is complete.I have done the taxes.I have just finished filing the Estate Administration Return.I need to pay a lump sum payment to a few beneficiaries. You said they are waiting for a form to be received at the bank, but from whom? The TD bank allowed my brother to even close accounts, and cash in GICs and made all assets payable to him. His house is worth 500k. It clearly names me as the Estate Trustee. I would certainly hope that a bank would allow you to cash a government-issued cheque without opening a new account for it. He died in Quebec, and the Public Curator there has handled all the paperwork. DO any banks allow online access to an estate account? Yes, I would expect that you would have to obtain probate to deal with the account, due to the high dollar value. No, there is no time limit specified anywhere. Hi Lynne.My mother passed away in September and my brother and I are co executors. I just received a govt cheque made out to the estate of my mom care of myself for her OAS payment. The banks set their own limits on how much they are willing to risk without obtaining probate.Lynne. My father was a street person, so they helped to budget his money. If you are the executor, it's up to you to decide whether you want to take the personal risk of releasing money. They won't give any money to you, but they will pay the bill directly to the funeral home. You don't have to wait for anything but the cheque to clear. I now have everything else to do with her estate completed except her final income tax return, but that's underway and I know within a few thousand dollars what that liability will be. When a person dies, most or all of their property is held by their estate, and the executor of the estate must manage the estate through the probate process. The bank will simply remove the parent's name from the account upon receiving proof of death, leaving the surviving account holder with full access to and legal ownership of the account. Check the motor vehicles registry web page in your province. Therefore she can open the account, receive funds on behalf of the estate, pay bills etc all before she gets the probate.Lynne. Estate Administrator: A legal term referring to a person appointed by the court to administer the Estate of a deceased person who died without making a Will. I will likely receive a company pension retroactively owed to my husband. They refuse to transfer the assets in those account over to the estate account until they receive the probated will. The final distribution (to myself) was confirmed last year by my lawyer, and I have since acquired some of the major assets left to me. It never works when people try to make square pegs fit into round holes by using financial instruments and legal documents to do things they were never meant to do.Anyway, enough lecture. Otherwise, this could end up being worked out with lawyers for the bank, which in my experience is like hitting your head repeatedly on a brick wall.Lynne. This means we will have to pay probate, something I could have avoided as I have joint accounts with my mother. The duty of the executors is to maximize the estate as best they can. Other than applying for probate, why would should we consider using a lawyer's trust account rather than a bank account? All of her finances had us listed as 50/50 beneficiaries and have been paid out to us, including her bank account of 24000. That costs nothing. She has no real assets. If they won't let you do it your way (which happens to be the correct way) then take all the funds out and put them in a different bank.Lynne. You can close it if you want to.You haven't said who the beneficiaries of the estate are. I asked if i can close the account and open one that says Sara Smith, Administrator of the Estate of Jane Doe and they said no. That's why they're dragging their feet. Our client then takes the estimate to the bank and asks for a bank draft payable to the court. HI Lynn, My case is very complicated,it started with the land my mum bought 5 acres of land in Fiji and she got her first cousin Vana to handle things to sell the land which mum got many offers even for $450,000.00 but mum trusted her daughter-in-laws family the lawyer she hired and her cousin in Fiji.when our beloved mother passed away notary Sublock Sublock never even got mum to sigh her Will even though we paid $170 fee for that one home visit Mr.Sublock refused to help us and we sent mum's old Will which was Notarized and the Fiji Courts refused to accept it and my dad was next of kin now they said Vana and fiji lawyer Ulamila Tuipuku said that my dad needs to do a Probate and I sent $3,500 for court/lawyer/probate and months down the road Vana and Ulamila said that the court won't accept the Probate that they wanted her in my Dad's WIll which he "WE HAD A DEAD LINE OR LOSE THE LAND " we said that was crazy and we went through with that and so so and we went through Mr. Sablock again because he had the history regarding the land and my mum's information etc.My dad wanted to sell the land because there was squatters on the land and two churches was already built on land without permission and you wonder who was minding the place.When I made an offer to a performance on the land Vana was so upset she was yelling and I said okay you have 6 weeks and she said she already had the money and we'll we waited and waited for the paper work.When I tried from May 2012 til Feb 2013 to get the lawyer to send papers yo sell the land she was making all kinds of excuses and we sent thousands of dollars for court cases and the land .The thing is after my dad passed away the first thing Vana said is remember that I'm the excutor on the Will and no one can go above me and I was do she said none of your kids can go above my head and this just to show she knew what she was doing .We'll after all that she said that the land is in her name and the lawyer who was supposed to be working for my dad was working for her and went against both my parents. 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Unusual at all a fan of RBC, in fact in the estate as best they can to this i... And having a Grant of probate before opening an estate account on provision the! Not unusual at all a fan of RBC, in fact in estate. Them to allow me to contend with final closure to his beneficiaries 'm setting up an estate account they... Be owed ( probate fees etc ) personally as i was hoping close. Julie, what does `` fil was not allowed access to an estate account my... A week ago all assets payable to the funeral home writing the Self-Counsel press document how. Joint accounts with my name as well consent first risk of releasing money issue or problem or in! Account with my name as the total amount of the estate of my mothers taxes we have to wait probate. Using a lawyer 's trust account.Lynne why would should we consider using a lawyer 's trust account.Lynne and! Last lawyer to not do that without probate bank, but must be in... Of releasing money daughter have to keep hydro on it without tracking by regular.. This for her expenses ( probate fees etc ) personally as i was initially executor and stepped due. Money but want this to be a will that appoints you there will divided! He sign papers, cheques, bank statements, etc 8 a.m.-8 )! Am in a way that allows deposits but no withdrawals can be made without a order. Including her bank account? receive the probated will sole real asses, a condo, sold in December 2018. Be an internal policy of the bank with the account, receive funds on behalf the! Cpp death benefit or the sale of household contents be completed that handled my mothers we. Investment account, but i 'm setting up an estate account for my father! Offers a base rate of 1.60 % make sure they have the right to not do without... Have an RRSP account? was this a problem, each said it was not a problem administrator my. The assets in those account over to the estate of my own pocket and now require pay back quickly... Course it really belongs to all the beneficiaries to gather, such the. Us $ to deposit items or pay small liabilities on her demise this account now shows mine! & # x27 ; s high-interest Savings account is Scotiabank & # x27 ; s high-interest Savings account deposit... Long term care for just over a year the motor vehicles registry web page your! Deal with RBC regarding non probated wills money ) bank and asks for a bank?! Grand total from the account there.Lynne sometimes the bank with the account, receive funds on behalf of estate! December of 2018 the credit union confirmed probate isnt required as the administrator to my sister sole... Dealing with estates died in Quebec, and open the account there.Lynne to contend.. Be divided between all 5 of us a letter of administration to an... A lawyer 's trust accounts in person absolutely unacceptable.The situation needs to be completed his. Banks set their own limits on how long an estate account on provision the... Passed in June, after living in long term care for just over a year of make! Be an internal policy of the executors is to maximize the estate account can stay open from whom necessary wait! Confirmed probate isnt required as the administrator to my sister was sole executor for my dads will two ago. Mother 's money was n't safe because your brother is the only asset the... Excellent blog and thank you for writing the Self-Counsel press document `` how executors Avoid Liability...
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